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> Ga 004 - Ranchu
Frankie
post Thu, 27 May 2004 3:35 pm
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QUOTE(Frankie @ Thu 27 May 2004 12:55 PM)
I'm so confused.  If breeders such as Kashino keep the best for themselves, then is there any value to those ranchus that they put up for sale to the general public? 

I assume such breeders have special skills in culling. And with this skill, the young fish that they put up for sale to the general public are the lousier ones?  Afterall, even an amatuer breeder knows how to cull fries with obvious defects, keeping less obviously defective one longer and cull them again when the defects are more obvious.  So the worse kind to buy are really the black babies, isn't it?  Afterall, I can't think of any reason why Kashino would put up babies with potential for sale to the general public!  Heck, if you don't belong to his group, even the tosai/nisai he sells you are probably not that great.  So I imagine a few diehards here are realizing they have been taken for a ride with those "Japanese" ranchus they paid good money for. You've been buying craps!  rofl2.gif

Well these Jap breeders are actually culling out fishes without potential not defects. They have a reputation to protect, they will not sell you fishes with physical defects such as no anal fins.. hehehehe....... Defective fishes are discarded.

If you are able to get your hands on a mature tosai or nisai, chances are you will be getting good fish as they would have recognised it is a potential fish in the beginning to keep till this age. Prices will be steep as well.

So for those people that buys black babies hoping that the breeders might have a day off in his culling, I would say it is unlikely cos the japs never miss !

You just have to accept the fact that you will be not buying their best fishes. What we are playing here are 2nd or 3rd tier fishes in jap high standards. At this level, the fishes that are available is consider good already. Like Geert point out, unless you breed your own. Now the question is, is breeding as simple as putting 2 males and 1 female of the same line ? I think, the thais will know better since they are still buying form the Japs.
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Frankie
post Fri, 28 May 2004 7:55 am
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QUOTE(Frankie @ Thu 27 May 2004 12:55 PM)
Afterall, I can't think of any reason why Kashino would put up babies with potential for sale to the general public!  Heck, if you don't belong to his group, even the tosai/nisai he sells you are probably not that great.  So I imagine a few diehards here are realizing they have been taken for a ride with those "Japanese" ranchus they paid good money for. You've been buying craps!  rofl2.gif

I think that just because a girl do not make it to the finals of the Miss Universe contest does not mean that she is not beautiful. With people like Kashino-san breeding probably hundreds of thousands of ranchu frys annually, it is impossible for him to keep all. I believe that what goes into the market are still probably the top 3% to 5% of the season's breed.

The other reason that I can think of is that it is the cheapest way to obtain a good bloodline if you intends to breed it yourself. Sometimes, not so-good looking parents can produce excellent offsprings. It is a numbers game. As Dr Matsui said the secret of good Japanese ranchu is in its ruthless or highly selective culling.

The other thing is that raising the fry is the harder part of this equation. Even champion frys raised by the wrong method will spoil the fish. I think in this respect, the Thais still have much to learn from the Japs.
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Frankie
post Fri, 28 May 2004 7:55 am
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QUOTE(Frankie @ Thu 27 May 2004 05:55 AM)
I'm so confused.  If breeders such as Kashino keep the best for themselves, then is there any value to those ranchus that they put up for sale to the general public? 

These Ranchu are VERY VALUABLE to breed from !
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Frankie
post Fri, 28 May 2004 8:50 am
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QUOTE(Frankie @ Thu 27 May 2004 12:55 PM)
I'm so confused.  If breeders such as Kashino keep the best for themselves, then is there any value to those ranchus that they put up for sale to the general public? 

I think if you are Mr Kashino. you will do the same. Will you sell your best ranchu and keep the bad ones. This is the only way to ensure that the bloodline remains superior. At least, we will continue to get good fish from him for many many years to come rather than to get one lot of very good fish and then stop there.

There are probably hundreds of thousands of ranchu hobbyist waiting to get hold of Kashino's best ranchu. It is more difficult to get Kashino's top ranchu than for one to strike lottery first prize, unless of course you offer your first prize lottery money to Kashino for his top ranchu.

I was told that there are many ranchu clubs all over Japan. Some of these clubs are small and they keep a specific bloodline and exchange with each other their ranchu for breeding. Even the top breeders exchange ranchu with each other or buys from other breeders just to ensure that they do not get too much inbreeding in their bloodline. Surely when Kashino gets one of these ranchus from other breeders, he will certainly not get the very best as well.

As Geert puts it, if you want the best, then breed it yourself. No one is so stupid as to sell his best and keep the second best unless someone offers a very good price for his best.
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DIYGOLD
post Fri, 28 May 2004 6:16 pm
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QUOTE(Frankie @ Thu 27 May 2004 12:55 PM)
Heck, if you don't belong to his group, even the tosai/nisai he sells you are probably not that great.  So I imagine a few diehards here are realizing they have been taken for a ride with those "Japanese" ranchus they paid good money for. You've been buying craps!  rofl2.gif

I think to understand what worth to buy takes a lot of experience and understanding how to select good and potential fish. Therefore it is always a learning curve for every beginners to take this ride. I believe the TRUE experts too.

Namaste
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