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Chinmo
helo guys, i'm new to this forum, i'm looking for solid side view ranchus.... thai or jap also can, but the problem is i do not know which lfs to visit? i know this ? been posted quite alot of times, but pls give me some directions blush.gif the one at sims ave(AC) , simon rd one? any other suggestions? pls advice... blush.gif Thanks u all in advance. good_very.gif
YLD
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 08:06 pm)
helo guys, i'm new to this forum, i'm looking for solid side view ranchus.... thai or jap also can, but the problem is i do not know which lfs to visit? i know this ? been posted quite alot of times, but pls give me some directions  blush.gif  the one at sims ave(AC) , simon rd one? any other suggestions? pls advice... blush.gif  Thanks u all in advance. good_very.gif
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What is a solid SV ranchu? How does it look like?
leogon
LCK lane 9, No. 50. take LCK road all the way just before the road ends turn right into lane 8 and to straight until u hit at T junction and turn right . look out for a A-4 size ranchu poster. price is reasonable for the quality.
A very good top view goes from $160 to 200
Side view from $35 to 120-400--600.
Oranda etc...$8(small types) - 180 (Giant Oranda from thai)
Black moor. $13 up.
Tosakin....$180

OR

Sean Wee at 96 Sungei Tengah (HOR)
Chinmo
cool! thanks bro! but i,m working tomolo, can't go lfsing. sad.gif maybe i go take a look this weekend shiok.gif Thanks!

Bro YLD, blush.gif cos i don't know what is AA, AAA or show grade like, so say "solid" 1 lor.... blush.gif happydance.gif
HappyBuddha
Here's my 2 cents worth....

Asking where you can eat a good hamburger is likely to get you many recommendations because burgers are aplenty AND when a diner tells you where to find them it's unlikely you can ruin his chances of getting a good bite for himself too; the chef can always make another one.

Good ranchus are rare in Singapore. If I know which LFS or farm currently has good ones (at realistic prices), I'd release this privilege info to someone I know and more importantly, someone whom I trust will treasure them. Why tell a stranger who might have an overstocked, nitrate-laiden tank and slowly ruin a good fish?

So, I suggest everyone especially newbies in goldfish to try your luck at the LFS listed in the FAQ section of the board, instead of hoping to get a good ranchu just by asking -- the experienced keepers/hunters won't tell you. biggrin.gif
YLD
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:09 pm)
cool! thanks bro! but i,m working tomolo, can't go lfsing. sad.gif  maybe i go take a look this weekend shiok.gif  Thanks!

Bro YLD,  blush.gif cos i don't know what is AA, AAA or show grade like, so say "solid" 1 lor.... blush.gif  happydance.gif
*



with due respect, if you dun know what is AA, AAA or show grade then how you going to know it when you see one. Actually i also dun know all this grading stuffs. Jus that i know what i would like to have in a ranchu and that can be very personal.

Im still learning...
desireless
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:09 pm)
cool! thanks bro! but i,m working tomolo, can't go lfsing. sad.gif  maybe i go take a look this weekend shiok.gif  Thanks!

Bro YLD,  blush.gif cos i don't know what is AA, AAA or show grade like, so say "solid" 1 lor.... blush.gif  happydance.gif
*

I would suggest you learn more about ranchus and way to rear them before jumping into it. Why burn money? I'm actually more concern about the fate of fishes (good or bad ones) in the hands of inexperienced hobbyists.

QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:14 pm)
If I know which LFS or farm currently has good ones (at realistic prices), I'd release this privilege info to someone I know and more importantly, someone whom I trust will treasure them.  Why tell a stranger who might have an overstocked, nitrate-laiden tank and slowly ruin a good fish?
*

I cannot agree more!! good_very.gif
YLD
QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:14 pm)
Good ranchus are rare in Singapore.  If I know which LFS or farm currently has good ones (at realistic prices), I'd release this privilege info to someone I know and more importantly, someone whom I trust will treasure them.  Why tell a stranger who might have an overstocked, nitrate-laiden tank and slowly ruin a good fish?

Is this sad or jus human nature?
HappyBuddha
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:35 pm)
Is this sad or jus human nature?
*

I think you didn't read properly, or maybe I misunderstand your question.

It's neither sad nor human nature. You see... goldfish and other pets are live stock. You can't keep them in the closet after you are done with the initial thrills of owning a new toy. And, when it comes to "solid" ranchus, it's a sin to ruin them because a newbies don't know how to take care of them despite his good intention to.

I hope I'm clearer now. Like I said, I'd gladly tell anyone where to get a good burger if they asked. Such a tip can be freely shared but... no tip on good ranchus.
desireless
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:35 pm)
Is this sad or jus human nature?
*

This is not "sad". Once you've reached a certain level in goldfish keeping, you will only go for good fishes. Why spend like $20 to buy a lousy ranchu only to go home and regret?

As this goes on, you'll start to wonder "where have all the good fishes gone to?" Then an idea struck... one good fish in the 1-feet tank of a 5-yr-old boy and the fish is suffering from gill flukes, dropsy, etc. And the owner still thinks the fish looks cute (due to bloated body) and has got the blur blur look (likes to hide in one corner). What a sad fate, isn't it?

Fishes deserve a good environment to stay in. All the more for a "solid" fish. And this responsibility lies in the hands of its owner. This is why our main purpose of this forum is to teach forumers the correct way of handling your fishes, handling the water/setup.

At least I wouldn't feel so bad if I see good fish in the hands of bros whom I know will take care of the fish well.
YLD
QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:50 pm)
I think you didn't read properly, or maybe I misunderstand your question.

It's neither sad nor human nature.  You see... goldfish and other pets are live stock.  You can't keep them in the closet after you are done with the initial thrills of owning a new toy.  And, when it comes to "solid" ranchus, it's a sin to ruin them because a newbies don't know how to take care of them despite his good intention to.

I hope I'm clearer now.  Like I said, I'd gladly tell anyone where to get a good burger if they asked.  Such a tip can be freely shared but... no tip on good ranchus.
*


I did read it well but im coming from a diff point of view and I didnt make it clear but jus keep it that way.

Anyway....

When can a newbie upgrade his status?

When can someone access to tips on good ranchu?
CyberET
theres no such thing as good SV jap ranchu
thai and china would be the way to go.. although i prefer the chinese ranchu

and i agree with HB and desireless smile.gif
desireless
There's no such thing as "rank" lah..

Bros here knows each other from our monthly meeting and through discussions, we know who are the "good hands". I'm of course more willing to share "where to get the really 'solid' ranchus" with them. But for newbies, the LFS list in the FAQ section serve its purpose already. Those highlighted are the ones which are "above average" among the hundreds of LFS locally.

QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:50 pm)
....And, when it comes to "solid" ranchus, it's a sin to ruin them because a newbies don't know how to take care of them despite his good intention to.
*

Agree completely good.gif
YLD
QUOTE(desireless @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 09:51 pm)
This is not "sad". Once you've reached a certain level in goldfish keeping, you will only go for good fishes. Why spend like $20 to buy a lousy ranchu only to go home and regret?

As this goes on, you'll start to wonder "where have all the good fishes gone to?" Then an idea struck... one good fish in the 1-feet tank of a 5-yr-old boy and the fish is suffering from gill flukes, dropsy, etc. And the owner still thinks the fish looks cute (due to bloated body) and has got the blur blur look (likes to hide in one corner). What a sad fate, isn't it?

Fishes deserve a good environment to stay in. All the more for a "solid" fish. And this responsibility lies in the hands of its owner. This is why our main purpose of this forum is to teach forumers the correct way of handling your fishes, handling the water/setup.

At least I wouldn't feel so bad if I see good fish in the hands of bros whom I know will take care of the fish well.
*


Most ppl here want to give their beloved goldfish a good life. Perhaps some lack the know how and therefore the existence of this forum is important.

btw, i sometime really wonder where has all the good fishes gone to? And here come my favourite question. What is a good ranchu? Pls enlighten me with your personal views.
CyberET
where have all the good fishes gone? gone to ppl with deep pockets, but dunno how to keep them sad.gif but LFS owners reserve for them because they r the big spenders.. what to do? they r running a business after all.. anyway sg don't have the buying power le.. all the good fish fly pass singapore sad.gif

as to what is a good ranchu.. dunno how to put it into words and pictures.. have to view the actual fish in front, then easier to explain.. maybe you tell us what u think is a good ranchu, and we guide u along?
HappyBuddha
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:03 pm)
When can a newbie upgrade his status?

When can someone access to tips on good ranchu?
*

Hmm... diffcult questions and I pondered for a long while but I still don't have the answers. I'll come back to you on them... but maybe you can tell me your views on them? unsure.gif
desireless
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:12 pm)
.... What is a good ranchu? Pls enlighten me with your personal views.
*

Here
Clear and easily understood
Chinmo
i understand the bros point, i have goldfish at hm, i kept goldfish since primary sch, i have some that was from pasir ris farm, but was thinking getting some even better SV and TV, my dad loves TV but i like SV. goldfish not a new pet for me, just needed to know where can get ranchus better than my hse one... don't know grading can slowly learn, but think most lfs won't know the grading, unless they r specialised in goldfish. tongue.gif

thank for the tips. smile.gif
Chinmo
erm.... gd ranchus to me it's like drooling over a nice or solid ranchus at lfs.....hahahahah! the pasir ris one, okie lah, very nice ranchus they have, but was thinking of getting 1-2 pcs machiam show grade type. haha.
CyberET
what really is show grade? y let the grade affect your judgement? let the fish do the talking smile.gif
cktan
QUOTE(CyberET @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:38 pm)
what really is show grade? y let the grade affect your judgement? let the fish do the talking smile.gif
*


Thats right. What grade. Just choose a goldfish whcih u think is good and nuture it well. Its the side view China goldfish that has taken ppl by storm and not TV ranchu. Then Jap came out with TV goldfish. Maybe oneday, someone can come up with a Front View Ranchu, Underside View, Back View etc...
YLD
QUOTE(desireless @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:25 pm)
Here
Clear and easily understood
*

Doremon is the basic, the fundamental, the reference fish. Now i understand why so hard to get this type of fish. kekeke!!


Bro HB, any update of doremon?
Chinmo
some pics of my dad's goldfish, i'm looking for the smae or maybe better standards? tongue.gif

love them alot shiok.gif




IPB Image
YLD
QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:24 pm)
Hmm... diffcult questions and I pondered for a long while but I still don't have the answers.  I'll come back to you on them... but maybe you can tell me your views on them? unsure.gif
*


I thought there are tough too.

For the first question: a before and after pic speak volume.

For the Second question: this is really a tough nut to crack and im in no position to comment on the possible solutions. would definitely like to hear your view on this one.
HappyBuddha
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:50 pm)
Bro HB, any update of doremon?
*

Damn. I was hoping no one will ever ask. tongue.gif

I have to put him to sleep just 2-3 weeks ago. He's 2+ years old but already very weak... As you can see from that pic, he was stunt when I bought him and it remained so small (the tails and eyes got really big) while other fishes of the same age outgrew it. mad.gif
Chinmo
another one which i wish can fing others like him. shiok.gif


IPB Image
Seacucumber
QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:03 pm)
I did read it well but im coming from a diff point of view and I didnt make it clear but jus keep it that way.

Anyway....

When can a newbie upgrade his status?

When can someone access to tips on good ranchu?
*


you will know when you are there.....BUT have to stress on one thing....
theres always a taller mountain as the chinese saying goes....
Seacucumber
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:34 pm)
erm.... gd ranchus to me it's like drooling over a nice or solid ranchus at lfs.....hahahahah! the pasir ris one, okie lah, very nice ranchus they have, but was thinking of getting 1-2 pcs machiam show grade type. haha.
*



grading is of no importance....
its just a status to raise the price tag of the fish....

all boils down to your skills and experience again....
a showgrade or a perfect ranchu will be ruined if kept by someone with only knowledge of keeping luohan...
Seacucumber
QUOTE(CyberET @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:38 pm)
what really is show grade? y let the grade affect your judgement? let the fish do the talking smile.gif
*



the one u used as your avatar lor....
biggrin.gif
CyberET
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:11 pm)
the one u used as your avatar lor....
biggrin.gif
*

har? the demekin? died liaoz cry.gif
leogon
Not a crime to help direct interested parties to where some good fish are.
One can't possibly buy up every good fish there is, so try being a bit less selfish and tell others where they can go without having to waste their precious time.
It really doesn't take much effort to recognise what a good ranchu should look like and the more difficult part is to maintain/improve/groom good fish. Unfortunately, good fish are not cheap but don't be disheartened when you miss out on buying some - there will ALWAYS be other nice ones down the road...just be patient!
Seacucumber
QUOTE(CyberET @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:13 pm)
har? the demekin? died liaoz cry.gif
*



huh??
aiyah.....my little fellow u saw at Fishlove is in ICU now.....
cry.gif
CyberET
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:16 pm)
huh??
aiyah.....my little fellow u saw at Fishlove is in ICU now.....
cry.gif
*

har? which one, u submitted 3 right?
YLD
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:07 pm)
you will know when you are there.....BUT have to stress on one thing....
theres always a taller mountain as the chinese saying goes....
*



Im not a status seeker but i understand where i stand. Also not all tall mountain willin to share or rather IMHO there share selectively!
Seacucumber
QUOTE(CyberET @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:18 pm)
har? which one, u submitted 3 right?
*

the one Alvin quoted..

"almost a perfect fish"

QUOTE(YLD @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:19 pm)
Im not a status seeker but i understand where i stand. Also not all tall mountain willin to share or rather IMHO there share selectively!
*

hoah......ATOS.....
what i mean is that NEVER STOP LEARNING......
no one is a guru of any sort....
even top breeders or top clubs experience probelms...

sharing selectively?? u are right.....
thats why different clubs in Japan or even different farms in China and Thailand dun exchange ideas.....each have their own ways....
RBT
All those LFS that has been recommended carries good GFS,now is the patience part.

Different shipments may have 1 or 2 that may be up to your standard...hehe...know of a bro who go round lfs always the first one there....what i mean is patience bro.

And who knows,bros here keep seeing your inputs n keenest n interest may 1 2 test u out(anyway they will see the way u post,they will know whether u know what u r suppose know u know what i mean??hehe).Then when u PM them,surprise u r member liao!!!!!

Go round look c look c sure can find wan...but the key is patience(shit i laow liao so lohsoh...)
Chinmo
thanks bros, sorry to cos some arguements blush.gif , will be going around to check out their ranchus, hopefully fing some that i like. shiok.gif
Seacucumber
patience....patience.....
now is not the season.....
durian haven't drop yet..... biggrin.gif

QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:30 pm)
thanks bros, sorry to cos some arguements blush.gif , will be going around to check out their ranchus, hopefully fing some that i like. shiok.gif
*

find.....do not fing... biggrin.gif
CyberET
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:20 pm)
the one Alvin quoted..

"almost a perfect fish"
*

pai sei, forgotten liaoz sad.gif
so how is it now? any better?
Chinmo
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:31 pm)
find.....do not fing... biggrin.gif
*


blush.gif typo error blush.gif tongue.gif
Seacucumber
QUOTE(CyberET @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:31 pm)
pai sei, forgotten liaoz sad.gif
so how is it now? any better?
*


today first day of treatment....
keeping my fingers cross.....
if i lose him, i give up this hobby....and keep luohan....
RBT
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:30 pm)
thanks bros, sorry to cos some arguements blush.gif , will be going around to check out their ranchus, hopefully fing some that i like. shiok.gif
*


Seen your pics sure can find wan....go round those recommended lfs ask when next shipment arrive get stool ready n sit n stare....not shiok wait for another shipment(n in the meantime look out in buy/sell sometimes got good ones that "may" meet your standard)

laow liao..laow liao....

Patience....bro....patience yes.gif
Chinmo
QUOTE(RBT @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:38 pm)
Seen your pics sure can find wan....go round those recommended lfs ask when next shipment arrive get stool ready n sit n stare....not shiok wait for another shipment(n in the meantime look out in buy/sell sometimes got good ones that "may" meet your standard)

laow liao..laow liao....

Patience....bro....patience yes.gif
*


yes bro, will go check out the lfs first b4 getting any for myself. shiok.gif money not easy to earn, must spend it wisely and worthy! laugh.gif
YLD
QUOTE(HappyBuddha @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:03 pm)
Damn.  I was hoping no one will ever ask. tongue.gif

I have to put him to sleep just 2-3 weeks ago.  He's 2+ years old but already very weak... As you can see from that pic, he was stunt when I bought him and it remained so small (the tails and eyes got really big) while other fishes of the same age outgrew it.  mad.gif
*


Doremon is a "public figure". So sad.
Seacucumber
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:42 pm)
yes bro, will go check out the lfs first b4 getting any for myself. shiok.gif  money not easy to earn, must spend it wisely and worthy! laugh.gif
*


and also, must keep your fish properly.....
dun waste money....
YLD
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:24 pm)
hoah......ATOS.....
what i mean is that NEVER STOP LEARNING......
no one is a guru of any sort....
even top breeders or top clubs experience probelms...

sharing selectively?? u are right.....
thats why different clubs in Japan or even different farms in China and Thailand dun exchange ideas.....each have their own ways....
*



"never stop learning" that right, no doubt. As stated above, information is shared selectively, how to learn continuously? This is tough! kekeke!

I do hope local clubs are not following what the superior ones are doing in thai, jap and china. jus a dream!!!
CyberET
QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 10:58 pm)
some pics of my dad's goldfish, i'm looking for the smae or maybe better standards? tongue.gif

love them alot shiok.gif

*



QUOTE(Chinmo @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:06 pm)
another one  which i wish can fing others like him. shiok.gif

*

i think u can easily find such quality at 35a, 35b, Aquatic Connection, QH recently got some big ones as well smile.gif
Chinmo
QUOTE(CyberET @ Fri, 03 Sep 2004 12:19 am)
i think u can easily find such quality at 35a, 35b, Aquatic Connection, QH recently got some big ones as well smile.gif
*


thanks for the info bro, must go cc lok lok got better than those i posted anot first b4 buying, tongue.gif want to buy, must buy very nice ones... tongue.gif good_very.gif
CyberET
QUOTE(g-string @ Thu, 02 Sep 2004 11:32 pm)
today first day of treatment....
keeping my fingers cross.....
if i lose him, i give up this hobby....and keep luohan....
*

laugh.gif good luck
The Matrix
Started from a short message .... then ... 1st time I see such a loooooonnnnngggggg thread within a day, actually just hours.

Okay, a few interesting arguement here and since all fallen asleep, i just drop in my opinions ...

Grading
In fact, not just Thailand breeders doing grading, but Chinese and Japanese as well. However, when comes to grading, it depends on how one breeder judge and experience in judging. To certain extend, grading helps to sell fish in batches and of course, income to the breeders. However, not many people understand such grading unless one has been taught on what each level or grade means.

As of right now, let's not talk about such sensitive topic. But to focus on how one decide to buy a fish with respect to how one understand a fish. Grading will only cloud your decision.

Keeping
No matter what fish, from hot to cold or from hard to blackish water, the MOST important thing a hobbyist should start with is understand the fish and the required environment. We might not be able to "move" the Amazon River to our house just to keep discus or Lake Malawi just to keep cichlids. But we can, in some way, understand what these fish prefered, what they need, what they afraid, what they eat, then we think of HOW we can achieve by providing these WHATs.

Don't tell me goldfish also come from common goldfish and they live in the wild river. What we have in our home ARE fanciful goldfish, cross bred for hundred of years, grown in China, Japan or Thailand farms, sold to those shops, and we buy them. They won't be able to survive in the wild. There are vast information here, if not enough, the internet contains hundreds of search pages about goldfish, their breeding, their habitats, their food, etc. All one need is to read, digest, understand and focus on the HOWs.

Buying Power
Sensitive leh. Different people has different wallets and pockets. Anyone who would afford to buy 20 kashino at sky rocket price, dun need to envy. Important is can one keep it well. Full-stop.


Upgrading of newbies
Like HB mentioned, TOUGH !
In actual fact, everyday you are learning about your own fish. Everyone is a new keeper. It is not how many one can buy or how much one can afford. To me, a very simple and easy indicator about one's knowledge is to tell yourself this -> My previous fishes are not nice at all comparing to present ones.

Then I say you have move higher level of understanding. How high can it goes ? No limit.

skill, experience
Skill and experience is not easy topic to write. All voice down to individual eagerness, determination, perseverance, endurance and very very important about attaining skill and gaining experience is Passion.

I am not talking about i like ranchu today, guppy tomorrow, betta the next. Might as well print some pictures or put a nice one in that CTRL-ALT-DEL MSWindow screen (kekekeke APPLE users I dunno what to call it). The people here I know of are putting in a lot of effort, time, delication and sacrifies just to keep their fish in a very good environment.

One will argue that I only want a tank to beautify my house, or just something to relax and watch after a day of hard work. I believe if one buy a dog or cat, one will learn or try to learn everything about keeping them. Don't tell me u don't bath, feed and clean up their environment. Will you hug a sick dog ?

Directing to lfs
Nothing wrong with it. But I guess HB done a good job listing down all the shops that bring in goldfish. Well, not everyday one can find good ones, but at least, we know where are such shops or farms that we could visit when we are free and probably got a chance to buy 1 or 2. But of course, if one constantly promoting for a single source, then that's something we, as a hobbyist, should be aware of the intent.

Information sharing
Highly sensitive issue. Did anyone search anything about goldfish in the WWW ? Of course ! Ton of papers just to print them all out.

But all talking about history, food, water, filter, pictures, more pictures and languages that one could not understand.

But did anyone noticed that no breeders will mention about their breeding techniques, breeding stocks, culling methology and how they see what really is good.

These are kept secret, commercially not viable to fill the public with such information, worst of all, many of the chinese farm are family controlled and information are passed down to the "chosen" one.

Such information are hard, near impossible, to gather. One needs to gain experience through years of painful mistakes. Many takes years even with guidance. Forums, websites are channel of mass communication. With many different skillset, experience gathering together at a single place is like a pub with good and bad drinkers. Some like wine, some beer, some girls.

Some of the people here has organised gatherings in a regular basis. These, in fact, is a better channel to communicate, interact and discuss. Understanding each other better and in return a strong tie within a small community, better cooperation, improving in a orderly manner, Achieve MORE. Don't you (those that has went to these gatherings) find it that way ?

Let's go back to have fun ! Start looking at your fish ...
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