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RafflesGold Forums > Discussion Area > Green Water, Filtration and Tank Setup
CP
The benefits of green water may or may not have been well documented; but one thing's for sure - it certainly beats raising my fish in my home filtered tank.Seeing a couple of recent posts on green water cultivation these fews days and having taken a few pics of my green water kept fishes today, let me begin with a couple shots of the outdoor pond:

Here is how the pond will look like under normal circumstances.Yes, you cannot see your fishes. sad.gif
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Here is roughly how it looks like immediately after a water change.You can catch a glimpse of them before they dissapear again in a couple of days......
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Here is how a scoop of green water looks like in a white bowl under sunlight:
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CP
As Matrix always liked to say " show me your fish!!". Now I say....NAH!!

We begin with my Aquarama competitor (but win nothing lah biggrin.gif ), one that I obtained in Jan this year, home kept till Aquarama in May 05, green water kept for the last 3 months.My current avatar as well.

Here is a pic of him in action in Aquarama (2nd pic):
http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.ph...ost&p=29306



Here is how he looked today:
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CP
Next we have the out-of-shape big fat female with the congested eggs problem:
http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.ph...ost&p=29605


Today she is still as out-of-shape as ever but obviously different in terms of colouration.

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CP
Moving on is a piece i obtained in May and raised in green water for the last 2 months:
http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.ph...ost&p=31314


Note the increase in bulk and the red colouration of the headgrowth.

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CP
Lastly, my cheapo ranchus:
http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.ph...ost&p=34044


Compare their state today:

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CP
Notice the splendour and lusture of the colouration of this ryukin.

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and this:

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But these are not my fishes. hysterical.gif
peter porker
A sight to behold.
goldrush
Wah got pond visit never invite me dry.gif

Next time got outing can gather a few kakis to feast on fish and snacks but not fish and chips over a drink or two.hehehehehehhehehehe

Just my wishful suggestion rolleyes.gif
CyberET
no wonder that day seem so busy tongue.gif
CP
QUOTE(goldrush @ Mon, 24 Oct 2005 9:30 am)
Wah got pond visit never invite me dry.gif
*



Har, I thot you are only interested in porn visit not pond visit.??
gold2dee
i am just wondering why Geert Ranchu's color is equally good despite not using green water? Is it because of JRL pellets?
CP
QUOTE(gold2dee @ Mon, 24 Oct 2005 12:02 pm)
i am just wondering why Geert Ranchu's color is equally good despite not using green water? Is it because of JRL pellets?
*


Even though he does not use green water, there are plenty of algaes in his tubs for his ranchus to feast on 24hrs a day.
goldrush
QUOTE(CP @ Mon, 24 Oct 2005 11:11 am)
Har, I thot you are only interested in porn visit not pond visit.??
*





You dirty Lau lang mad.gif

The other pond site which I visit is

http://home.pond.com/

Here are something for you to PONDer.............

If I write I write with my duPOND

if I'm hungry I go to PONDerosa

if you make me angry I'll resPOND

your frivolous remark make me desPOND

So don’t make me throw you in your POND


Time for my POND chiak chiak lesson…..... loverdance.gif loverdance.gif loverdance.gif
The Matrix
ahhh ... so all the secrets of outdoor green water are out ...
goldrush
Your secret green no secret anymore....................(Secret Love by Doris Day)
The Matrix
so simple meh ... peace.gif
desireless
QUOTE(The Matrix @ Tue, 25 Oct 2005 10:16 am)
so simple meh ...  peace.gif
*


Agree. Like you say... where got so easy? There are still plenty of Green Water issues that are yet to be ventured and more importantly, yet to be documented.

Since there are so many "top secrets" in goldfish keeping which cannot be told to the public, one alternate way of learning is to go through forums where forumers can post their experience, and then hopefully learn from their successes and failures.
CP
QUOTE(The Matrix @ Tue, 25 Oct 2005 10:16 am)
so simple meh ...  peace.gif
*


In life, it is usually easy to do one thing,but very difficult to excel.

It is easy to pass an examination but difficult to score a distinction.

It is easy to pick up a game of ping pong but difficult to master it to a high level.

Green water to me is simply cultivate it once, and seed it subsequently during the water changes.Its that easy.No fanciful filtration system.But beyond this there may be tonnes of info and fine tuning to be learnt or discovered.I dont know.

I hope it is that simple for life is already complicated enough.
The Matrix
hmmmm 2 replies, just 1 to answer .... cp, the basic is "show me your fish" ... the true meaning is yet to be discovered. feel deep in your heart, think of the past 2 weekends. dun need to say it out, becos words not able to describe it. just feel it.
desireless
Yeah... feel it. The past 2 weeks probably give a lot of local outdoor green water practitioners some harsh lessons. Big ponds or small ponds probably had some big-time or small-time tragics.... cry.gif

But regardless of what happened, most important is the lesson learnt. And better still, be able to document what you observe and the possible causes.

It is easy to tell the benefits and disadvantages of green water. But it takes a lot more to tell what situations will consitute to what kind of outcomes. That's the fun of using green water, probably biggrin.gif
gold2dee
QUOTE(CP @ Mon, 24 Oct 2005 2:25 pm)
Even though he does not use green water, there are plenty of algaes in his tubs for his ranchus to feast on 24hrs a day.
*



If it is the wall algae that helps in goldfish color enhancement which produce equally good results as compared to green water, then is there still a need to use green water? Do u think it might be better to cultivate wall algae instead since keeping goldfish in clear water has the advantage that the goldfish can be seen?
desireless
Those are 2 different kind of algae and they have different benefits for for your fishes.

Even if they have the same mechanism to remove nitrate from your water, given a 4 feet tank with same load, the amount of wall algae do not possess enough 'strength' to remove the nitrate from the tank totally as compared to if you fill it up with Green Water.

It is still how you reason out yourself using clear water or green water. Striking a balance between how you want your fish to turn out to be and your desire to see them.
gold2dee
Performing 100% water changes every 4 or 5 days if using wall algae just like what Geert is doing (Im not sure whether he remove those algae as well when he perform those 100% water changes). His goldfish turn out to be excellent in color.

If u r implying that keeping goldfish in green water will result in better headgrowth, color (which i agree too) etc.. then how did Geert goldfish acheive equally good result without using green water?
desireless
Please note that I am NOT implying that the method with clear water with wall algae is NO GOOD. There are still hobbyists who use this method with good result. If you can be so zealous and discipline to change water every 4-5 days, then perhaps yes, you can have the benefits of both camps. But those are not really the only things that Geert have done to achieve the standards of his ranchus. Use the same zealousness to search on Geert's past posts. There are many in which he mentioned about feeding blood worm, JRL, etc and how he manages his water to give optimum environment for his fishes.

The benefits of green water can be found here. And the pictorial proof is found in this topic. And one thing that that CP did not mentioned, is that with green water, he can afford to feed cheap pellets with Automatic Feeder and leaves his fish unattended for as long as the pellets/batteries last. Even so, no worry for food issue as there is abundance of it in the green water itself.

I manage to convince myself with a "no" to "Do I need to admire/see my fishes EVERYDAY?". So knowing the benefits of green water, which I keep my fishes in, I rotate 2 of them every 2-3 months, so that I still have 2 to admire in my only 4feet display tank at home.
gold2dee
I recall that he dont use bloodworms. Only JRL. Didnt do anything to his water, not even adding any anti-chlorine to it. Only using heavily aerated (to remove chlorine) aged water. What he did is what green water users are doing except that he performs 100% water changes while we seed back 10-20% green water. Craig perform 100% water changes as well and feed his goldfish JRL. His goldfish color wasnt that good until he removes those "shades" and allow more sunshine to pass thru resulting in wall algae in his tubs.

Judging from Craig goldfish house article, it seems that JRL doesnt seem to play a big part in color enhancement of goldfish.

I tried the clear water method few days back but the goldfish smell is so foul that i gave up. I still prefer the green water which has this flora scent smile.gif.
desireless
Sorry, I did not phrase myself well enough. Yes, Geert mentioned before that he does not use BW.

But he did mention 3 types of food and their uses:

For Bulkiness - JRL
For Headgrowth - BW
For colour, wen and scales- Algae

All these (which you would want to achieve with your ranchus) can be compensated by green water, was what I was trying to say.
gold2dee
Yes, he also did mention to groom a goldfish, one has to observe it everyday so as to determine what to feed for the day or not to feed at all. I guess that might be the reason why he chose clear water over green water.
CP
A further update on my $10 cheapo ranchus reaping the benefits of green water.

Here's how they looked like back in July and Sept 05:
http://www.rafflesgold.com/forums/index.ph...opic=2408&st=30



Here's how some of them looked like today:
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CP
My favourite cheapo ranchu:

Jul 05 (swimming at top):
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Aug 05:
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Oct 05:
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In action at 2nd Nat Ranchu Comp Jan 06:
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Currently, May 06:
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goldrush
Welcome to our CULLTURED CLUB

Your little boy, Geogre here would be extremely proud to have you as an honorary member.you have culltivate it well.Unfortunately you are not exhibiting it at the coming show??????


3 Cheers to cp cheers.gif cheers.gif cheers.gif

Here's a drum of CULLSBERG for you

Remember :IT IS PART OF THE GAME........ drunk.gif drunk.gif drunk.gif
white horse T1
CP
yr arm very hairy.......... tongue.gif good.gif
the fish got mistake them for blood worm boh..... tongue.gif
CP
Nah, they did not mistaken them for bw.
They mistaken them for tubifex.


You consider those hairy?Wait till you see the hairs on other parts of my body..... rolleyes.gif
geiger
I was just wondering. after you take your fish out of green water and put them in clear water, do they keep the shape and improvment or revert back to form before green water?
CP
QUOTE(geiger @ Tue, 06 Jun 2006 9:26 pm)
I was just wondering. after you take your fish out of green water and put them in clear water, do they keep the shape and improvment or revert back to form before green water?
*


For juvenile fish, they will still grow.For adult fish, I find that they will lose some mass, say after 2 months.

But the move obvious difference will be the loss of colouration, especially on the fins and tails.That is why I usually do not keep them out of the green water for more than three months.
CP
One year on...................23 July 06.
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mountain
lookout.gif Tail so big .. stunt liao! rolleyes.gif
CP
dry.gif dry.gif dry.gif
cheangv
Can also see your feet standing in the pond : )
top_view_ranchu
Hello Ah Lau,
I find the weather really too hot, so like to shower you with some ice cold water! nananana.gif

I don't deny green water is good, coz I've tried it on my own. good_very.gif But I feel it's a bit misleading, if hobbyist (especially newbies) start to feel that that's the best and only way. Cannot go green? Don't start? Give up?
Did I see some dark clouds already forming at that far end? sweatingbullets.gif

I have a group of 5 kakis(including myself). 5 different methods of keeping. All managing very well, and even better then mine! We respect each others method of keeping and exchange ideas. Important thing is to practise within your capabilties and be FLEXIBLE!

Hi hi! Ah Lau................still there???

Wa..........raining liao.............better go hide!
.......................run.....................run............................invisible!
goldrush
gathering.gif

You got 5 kakis with 5 different setups
I go no kaki but 5 different setups

So can I achieve similar results with differnet setups with minimal fuss and problems??????

only Time will tell

Hey I'm willing to get my green fingers burn to find the truth...refer to my green setup threads

You may incur someone turning GREEN with rage(There are many incredible Hulks here)if you are not careful

secret2.gif
CP
QUOTE(top_view_ranchu @ Fri, 04 Aug 2006 2:20 pm) *

But I feel it's a bit misleading, if hobbyist (especially newbies) start to feel that that's the best and only way. Cannot go green? Don't start? Give up?

Hello, knock knock, hello, knock knock.Hmm......sounds hollow to me.


Never have I ever preached that its the best and only way.I re-quote myself at the start of this topic
"it certainly beats raising my fish in my home filtered tank".
QUOTE(CP @ Sun, 23 Oct 2005 11:24 pm) *

The benefits of green water may or may not have been well documented; but one thing's for sure - it certainly beats raising my fish in my home filtered tank.

BEND OVER AGAIN!! mad.gif

At this juncture, I find green water the best method.I have not tried other methods though, such as carpet algae, no filtration method, drip method, flush method or whatsoever.And, at this juncture too, I find that the results are good enough and managing green water is not as difficult as I had thot initially.

I do not have 9Ranchus or Goldie or YLD as my kakis.................

I only have a bunch of @#!!&%*^!!!*@&% friends and we respect each others method as well (cos' we all use the same method hysterical.gif ), and presently we find that this is the best option at the moment.

Yea.......need to use green text.
top_view_ranchu
QUOTE(goldrush @ Fri, 04 Aug 2006 2:51 pm) *

gathering.gif

You got 5 kakis with 5 different setups
I go no kaki but 5 different setups

So can I achieve similar results with differnet setups with minimal fuss and problems??????

only Time will tell

Hey I'm willing to get my green fingers burn to find the truth...refer to my green setup threads

You may incur someone turning GREEN with rage(There are many incredible Hulks here)if you are not careful

secret2.gif


Doc,
Simply with 5 different setups will not be able to tell which is the better one. Much more combinations to try out leh!

QUOTE(CP @ Fri, 04 Aug 2006 7:50 pm) *

Hello, knock knock, hello, knock knock.Hmm......sounds hollow to me.
Never have I ever preached that its the best and only way.I re-quote myself at the start of this topic
"it certainly beats raising my fish in my home filtered tank".

BEND OVER AGAIN!! mad.gif

At this juncture, I find green water the best method.I have not tried other methods though, such as carpet algae, no filtration method, drip method, flush method or whatsoever.And, at this juncture too, I find that the results are good enough and managing green water is not as difficult as I had thot initially.

I do not have 9Ranchus or Goldie or YLD as my kakis.................

I only have a bunch of @#!!&%*^!!!*@&% friends and we respect each others method as well (cos' we all use the same method hysterical.gif ), and presently we find that this is the best option at the moment.

Yea.......need to use green text.



Lau ah,
Thanks for the explaination hor.
You sud be glad you don't have the etc etc etc kakis! Or you'll have to bend over and over and over and over again! nananana.gif
CP
Long time no update,fish is now coming to 18 months old.

Growth has slowed down considerably, if none at all............... :sad


12 Nov 06
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The Matrix
1st fish not balance, 2nd piece underfed
CP
QUOTE(The Matrix @ Sun, 12 Nov 2006 7:13 pm) *

1st fish not balance

Apparently this is my only hope among my collection now leh....................... :sad
goldrush
QUOTE(CP @ Sun, 12 Nov 2006 10:51 pm) *

Apparently this is my only hope among my collection now leh....................... :sad



Only hope for what? blush.gif
desireless
1st fish looks more chubby now. I disagree that it is inbalanced.

As for 2nd one... same comment - not well fed.
The Matrix
QUOTE(desireless @ Sun, 12 Nov 2006 11:59 pm) *

1st fish looks more chubby now. I disagree that it is inbalanced.

As for 2nd one... same comment - not well fed.


nevermind about the not balance ...

i am more to let CP spare a little bit of his time to ponder over my comment ...
CP
QUOTE(goldrush @ Sun, 12 Nov 2006 11:00 pm) *

Only hope for what? blush.gif

Only hope in the sense that in the event that there is a Comp, whether its next year's Yuhua, MyFancy or Aquarama, this is the one and only that I have worthy of sending.



QUOTE(The Matrix @ Mon, 13 Nov 2006 2:01 am) *

i am more to let CP spare a little bit of his time to ponder over my comment ...

Aiya, the usual "have to think like Einstein" type of comments.


So I give a "have to think like Newton" type of answer:
I fully understand how the fish is not balanced.But you have to ponder on whether what I thought is what you meant. rolleyes.gif
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