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Hamad
Hello guys, I couldn't do this without your advice so here it is.

I am getting a box with 16 goldfish as soon as I confirm the order and send in the cash, it takes just one day for the box to reach me so I need to make sure everything is fine and set once the fish are here.

I believe that 16 fish will need 10 gallons each, a 160gallon tank is out of the question so I bought a 180 gallon plastic pool instead that I'll place in the balcony [it's much cheaper and the weather is ok now].

I am going to fill it with water today and then rinse it tomorrow just to test and then fill it and add aeration and have it ready for the fish. But what else should I add and should I treat the fish with anything? I would appreciate if anyone can give me very detailed information regarding this period such as how many water changes, how many times they should be fed, how much salt, etc...

Out of the 16 fish, 5 or 6 will move to the main 55gallon tank gradually [one fish every week], and any fish that doesn't look great to me I will sell to any of the local stores and just keep the best ones.

Thanks in advance!
goldrush
Dear Hamad I share your excitement to receiving your shipment but let us not let the excitement overwhelm us completely.What you need to prepare for the reception depends alot on the reputation and the preparation each dealer has done to their fishes.Experienced dealers would have starved their fishes to minimise ammonia spikes and unnecessary loss during their long journey.Assuming you are buying from one ,you still need to equalise the following before any introduction to your quarantine tank or pool in this case.
a)Temperature
b)pH
Though it is recommended that ratio fish to water is about 10gallons to a fish you must bear in mind that this is for rearing and not for quarantine purposes as you must be prepared to dose medication or other supplements which may not be too cost effective in such a reservoir during this period.But there are no hard and fast rules,so please read the thread under quarantine for details.
Now it debatable whether to medicate for parasites or bacteria during this phase but personally I do not mind including a mild disinfectant like acriflavine or proflavine based general tonic plus 0.3 % salt to boost up their morale.
What is important is the next few days to weeks which you need to do is to OBSERVE for outbreaks be it parasitic,bacteria or otherwise

Good luck
CyberET
make sure the water is ready the night before.. aerate the water.

upon arrival, equalize the temp for quite awhile (at least 30mins). add the tub's water into the box slowly, wait a few mins, pour 1/2 away.. and repeat.. until u r pretty confident the water parameters are almost equal to the fresh water tub.

transfer them into the tub without the original box's water. raise salt level to 0.5% salt..
observe them for a month at least...

try not to feed for the first week. aerate strongly.

have fun ;) do take some pictures in between when you are going thru the process smile.gif
Hamad
Thank you so much for the comments Goldrush! Do you suggest that I go with a smaller container? What size would you go for?

I still have around a week before I confirm which also gives me enough time to prepare everything. The farm is TungHoi and if I'm not wrong they're very experienced and reliable, I will ask them some questions as well about water levels and such to make sure the fish are not in high shock when introduced to their new home.

I also have Goldmed (which contains Formaldehyde and Malachite Green and limited carcinogenic effect) which a store owner around here recommended to be used only as half the dosage to disinfect any new parasites with new fish and then 80% water change. Of course I am not convinced about this but thought I should check your view on this.

Thanks a lot again and reading the quarantine details!
Hamad
QUOTE(CyberET @ Mon, 20 Mar 2006 10:54 am)
make sure the water is ready the night before.. aerate the water.

upon arrival, equalize the temp for quite awhile (at least 30mins). add the tub's water into the box slowly, wait a few mins, pour 1/2 away.. and repeat.. until u r pretty confident the water parameters are almost equal to the fresh water tub.

transfer them into the tub without the original box's water. raise salt level to 0.5% salt..
observe them for a month at least...

try not to feed for the first week. aerate strongly.

have fun ;) do take some pictures in between when you are going thru the process smile.gif
*



Easy-to-remember steps, thank you! I'll make sure I take pictures of the process, hopefully they'll arrive during the day and not night time or else I'll deal with flash which isn't as good. smile.gif
gohks
Hamad,
Given a choice, why do you need to order such a huge load at one goal. Isn't that too much risk exposed. sad.gif
Advisable to order in small quantity, the first most important thing to consider is to have a condusive home for your fish. Make sure they can adapt before you make a plunge. hi.gif
Hamad
No choice my friend sad.gif That is the minimum, in fact they wanted me to get over 60 fish as their minimum but a friend of mine in China went to their office to convince them and finally they let me have one box.

I didn't order AA goldfish because I did not want to spend a lot and then lose so much when something wrong happens, I got B graded fish and if all goes perfectly maybe in the (far) future when I have extra cash I'll get A/AA graded ones.

Anyway, they replied to me concerning the water levels and temperature and their way of care. They feed three times daily [9am, 12am, 3pm], PH range between 6.5-8.5, temperature ranges but they make sure no sudden change, 1/3 of water changed weekly and twice a month during winter.

So temperature and PH will not be a problem I guess. Should I add sponge filters or is air stones enough? I am filling up the pool as I type, I also have a large electric fan to cool the water when necessary.

Let me know if there's any thing to keep in mind, I have quarentined fish before but never that many at once together which is why I am making a big deal out of it, sorry if it's annoying.
CyberET
12am = 12midnight ? i think they meant 12noon.

air stones for the moment, you may need to change water, or add medications and you aren't surpose to be feeding yet tongue.gif

oh ya, how hot can your tub water get?
Hamad
Oh AM, that's my mistake sorry LOL

At 4:30/5pm the water was pretty cold today when I stuck my hand in there even though the weather was quite hot, hopefully that will still be the case in the summer sad.gif

I still didn't get the fish btw, perhaps after a week they'll be here. So do you suggest 100% water change weekly with airstones? Thanks for your reply ;)
CyberET
depending on water condition smile.gif
aronkhj
Hey Hamad,

personally, i will advise you not to worry too much.
clean you tanks and provide good areation and maybe a sponge filter.
you will should not be feeding the fishes for the first 2-4days, depending on the overall condition of the fishes, if they are lively and have adapted well, only small feeds after min of 48hrs.
don't worry about medications... but have them on stand by. JYP and the blue stuff for fin rot is good enough. jus remember... your fish will be really tired flying half way round the world... so don't stress them on arrival.
water change.... try changing at least >90% everyday for the initial 3-4days... then extend a bit... once every 2days.... again for 3 changes. again... extend to once every 3days for 3 changes. after that you fish should be in qt for ~21days...
jus monitor their conditions... and don't be too worried ok.

like i say.. they travel half way round the world.
i'd be really tired if it was me.

cheers !!! ARoN
Hamad
Thanks everyone, I needed details on how you would do it with this number of fish and this space.

I'm going to drain and refill the pool again and add the airstones. But changing water everyday will be a HUGE job though since this is 700 litres, I'll try my best and hopefully will work out fine.

Only worried fish sitting in basin waiting for drain and refill will get stressed as it takes more than an hour to go through that. Any other suggestions will be appreciated and thanks a lot again.
goldrush
How about refilling the pool to half its height. That will half the amount which will save you time,water and executing subsequent water changes and medication if required.
CyberET
how big are the fishes?
aronkhj
QUOTE(Hamad @ Wed, 22 Mar 2006 6:24 pm)
Thanks everyone, I needed details on how you would do it with this number of fish and this space.

I'm going to drain and refill the pool again and add the airstones. But changing water everyday will be a HUGE job though since this is 700 litres, I'll try my best and hopefully will work out fine.

Only worried fish sitting in basin waiting for drain and refill will get stressed as it takes more than an hour to go through that. Any other suggestions will be appreciated and thanks a lot again.
*



Hamad,
as ur in-coming stock will be quite large, will u have the possibility of seperating the lot?
and you might want to consider jus filling abt 50-60% full only.
fish sitting in the basin is really very stressfull.
Hamad
Each fish is between 12-14cm [head to tail], 8 Orandas and 8 butterflies. Two I'm going to give away. Tell me what you think of this plan for the first month:

Cycled tank for five fish (55gallons):
1- 50% water change every other day during 1st week (no food)
2- 50% water change every three days during 2nd week (introduce food)
3- 90% weekly water change routine starting from 3rd week
4- 0.5% Salinity during first two weeks

Half-filled Pool for the other 9 fish (180 gallons):
1- 100% water change every other day during first week (no food)
2- 100% water change every three days during 2nd week (introduce food)
3- 100% weekly water change routine starting from 3rd week
4- 0.5% Salinity during first two weeks
5- Two 10 gallon basins used for fish during water change [4-5 fish in each].

I'm afraid to do 100% water changes in the 55gallon cycled tank as I do not want to disturb the bacteria, the small fish in there I'll move to another smaller tank. Let me know if this plan is better as I tried to take a bit from everyone's advice here. Thanks. smile.gif
mountain
don't want to make your plans more complicated, but the "cycled" tank will become uncycled should you discover there are parasites in those fish. Its one of the reasons most of us don't do QT in cycled tanks. So no point worrying about preserving the bateria.

Qn: your orandas and dragoneyes should be coming in seperate packs. are they? If so, it would help if you don't mix them during QT. Its a silly bet but better then nothing.
Hamad
Alright, then that means just the pool and saving the cycled tank for after quarentine - I do not want to stress the fish through another cycle later if they do end up having parasites...

Then I could just try and see if I can get more basins during water change I guess for 14 fish. As for separating the orandas and dragoneyes, they're coming in the same box and will be quarentined together at the farm I think since they quarentine fish there before shipping them. Do I still need to separate them? sad.gif LOL
mountain
QUOTE(Hamad @ Sat, 25 Mar 2006 3:24 am)
Alright, then that means just the pool and saving the cycled tank for after quarentine - I do not want to stress the fish through another cycle later if they do end up having parasites...

Then I could just try and see if I can get more basins during water change I guess for 14 fish. As for separating the orandas and dragoneyes, they're coming in the same box and will be quarentined together at the farm I think since they quarentine fish there before shipping them. Do I still need to separate them? sad.gif LOL
*



then i guess you can save the effort to seperate them ;) you can use any basins actually.. as long as they don't leak! biggrin.gif just have to be sure they are free of detergents .
Hamad
Thanks Mountain, I am still going to search around and check if there are smaller good pools available to separate them just in case as I'm also worried over letting them sit for long in basins during water change.

P.S. Cool avatar!
mountain
how? unsure.gif
Hamad
How's what? LOL Your avatar? It's funny and unique, are you into flies? hehe

By the way, I was able to get three 100-150L white plastic tubs today, I think I'll be using those instead of the pool as they will be easier to maintain water changes. Will post pics of the tubs soon just to brag since I've been looking for those for like a year now.

My permission papers [for airport] are still not ready which is delaying the fish getting here, but that is good as I am having enough time to prepare everything. smile.gif
CyberET
actually 16 4inch fish for an hr or so in a 100L basin is ok, oxygen is your main concern, and strong aeration should do the trick.

I myself hold up to 30 fishes in a 100L basin for 1/2hr without aeration during water change. But thats the max without aeration as they'll start to flip upside down laugh.gif

don't worry so much and stress yourself smile.gif
you're on the right track ;)
Hamad
haha actually I was thinking of permanently keeping 4/3 in each tub instead of the pool, wouldn't that be better as they'd be separated and also water change will be much quicker?
CyberET
QUOTE(Hamad @ Wed, 29 Mar 2006 8:58 pm)
haha actually I was thinking of permanently keeping 4/3 in each tub instead of the pool, wouldn't that be better as they'd be separated and also water change will be much quicker?
*


not a bad idea also. If problem arise, it can be easily isolated into just 3-4 in each tub, rather than all of them ;)
Hamad
Finally the fish arrived, it was hell...Originally the fish were sent out of the farm to arrive here in the UAE at 1am. At the airport they had to move the box to another plane which was supposed to land at 2:30am, but that plane also got delayed and arrived in the UAE at 5am!!! It took me an hour to get them out of customs and then two hours drive back home and I got them here at 8am.

That means the fish were boxed for 7 extra hours because of delays, two bags were almost out of oxygen and unfortunately when I added them to the tubs [after letting the temperature balance for 30 mins then 20 mins introducing water slowly, all in all it was 50-55 mins until they were added to the tubs] two fish were already not in good health, one developed swimbladder problem and the other gasping for air, another two are also so/so. There is 0.3% salt in the water and I didn't want to do anythig else as what they have could be just stress and maybe tomorrow they'll get better.

Fortunately, all the others adjusted perfectly and running around like crazy, two even were chasing each other already!

I took lots of pictures, no side view shots though but soon once they're relaxed and doing well I will take some. The majority are far from being show quality but they're not ordinary either and together as a batch they look simply stunning!

I think making 100% water change tomorrow will be too much stress, I will do 50% tomorrow instead - no food of course for the whole week.

Thanks a lot guys and later tonight I'll post the pics... peace.gif
aronkhj
hey hamad.
glad to hear those fishes travelled half way round the world and made it to you.

your thoughts on what to do are on track. jus remember... if it was you doing all that travelling ... how would you feel.

do a 50-70% water change tomorrow. be quick so as not to stress the fish more.
as for food... after the second day... i like to jus drop very little bit in, once a day.

otherwise, jus enjoy your babies. post those pics soon ok.

and Congrats to you again!
Hamad
Thank you so much aronkhj, you're right they were very stressed because all of them now are running around so actively and recovered except for the one floating - the rest regained their energy it seems and I am very happy that they adjusted nicely!

An hour ago I bought two more tubs as well, one is 100 litre and the other about 60. Currently there is 5 to 6 fish in each of the three 150 tubs, I want to narrow it down to 4 to give them more space. I also found Melafix today which I'm going to dose with during the next water change.

Anyway as promised here's the pictures, they don't show the fish very well and I haven't taken good pictures of them but I will soon biggrin.gif

IPB Image
^^ tubs ready and waiting for the fish

IPB Image
^^ once I got home and opened the box...

IPB Image
^^ left the bags float for 30 minutes...

IPB Image
^^ introduction of tub water to the bags

IPB Image
^^ 20 minutes later, here's the first fish set free in the tub... good.gif

IPB Image
^^ two beloved butterflies, yeah one has unbalanced eyes LOL

IPB Image
^^ checking out the new place...

IPB Image
^^ the Orandas tub, 4 red and 2 red caps

IPB Image
^^ this tub has red/white and black butterflies, + 2 beautiful calico orandas

That's all there is, and I have to say thanks to everyone that replied to this thread because I truly learned a lot from the advises offered here. Will keep this thread updated throughout the quarentine period and hopefully it will go smoothly. peace.gif
sabine b
Hamad, I have seen several fish of Tung Hoi in the internet, and I know somebody who also got fish from them. and they were all adorable. So nice fish - In Europe I would dream of such lovely fish.
You are lucky.
gohks
Hamad, your fishes meant for TV rusure.gif
Hamad
Thank you Sabine! When it comes to Goldfish we also suffer here in the UAE, the quality of the fish we get is poor most of the time. sad.gif

Gohks, no the fishes aren't meant for TV, why do you ask? smile.gif

I do like the dragoneyes from the top though and intend to keep them in tubs but the rest will move to tanks after quarentine. ;)
gohks
QUOTE(Hamad @ Sun, 16 Apr 2006 1:33 am)

Gohks, no the fishes aren't meant for TV, why do you ask? smile.gif

*



Some fishes look nice from the top, e.g. the Calico Oranda good.gif
Hamad
Oh thank you, I'm glad you like that one, unfortunately I got a pair and the other one died this morning (the one tht looks better) so it's just one left - the other one died without showing any symptoms last night and this morning it was already gone sad.gif

I am currently treating with Tetra Goldmed [contains Formalin and Malachete] and did 100% water changes again - hopefully that will be the only loss and no more.
gohks
QUOTE(Hamad @ Mon, 17 Apr 2006 3:29 am)
Oh thank you, I'm glad you like that one, unfortunately I got a pair and the other one died this morning (the one tht looks better) so it's just one left - the other one died without showing any symptoms last night and this morning it was already gone sad.gif

*


Sad to hear that, that could happen during QT. sad.gif
Hamad
Thanks Gohks, increasing salinity to 0.7% in all tubs and doing salt dips + adding formalin for weaker fish has helped and now I'm already seeing more improvement.

My mother is giving me a hard time though regarding the tubs lining up indoors, so I am thinking of making a permanent indoor set up that can hold all the fish with enough room and with a system that will help me make 100% water changes without taking hours.

Anyhow, glad so far things are somehow under control and getting better, will update when all fish are 100% fine and kicking. ;)
aronkhj
QUOTE(Hamad @ Wed, 26 Apr 2006 8:26 pm)
Thanks Gohks, increasing salinity to 0.7% in all tubs and doing salt dips + adding formalin for weaker fish has helped and now I'm already seeing more improvement.

My mother is giving me a hard time though regarding the tubs lining up indoors, so I am thinking of making a permanent indoor set up that can hold all the fish with enough room and with a system that will help me make 100% water changes without taking hours.

Anyhow, glad so far things are somehow under control and getting better, will update when all fish are 100% fine and kicking. ;)
*




Hi Hamad,
It's been some time now since we last heard from you, so i guess no news is good news?
How are the fishes doing? really do like to see how are they doing now!

Take care and Good Luck!

Cheers! ARoN
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