It was my last day in bangkok and was suppose to be flying back to Singapore on evening flight. I was relatively disapointed because I could not meet my quota of my intended purchase. I was thinking to myself, flying all the way to bangkok and only bring back one fish which I bought from Mr BOY the day before,hmmm seems like the trip is ruin. I have seen hundreds of AA, AAA & Showgrade fishes, in the last 2 farms, not doubt there are good fishes, but none catches my eye or they are Nisai or Oya size which is too big & $$ for me(I was looking for Junior or full Tosai)

Mr Pat SMS the evening before, "Hey dude, what time tomorrow morning you coming over to my farm, tell me the time and place and I will pick you up, we can talk fish all day!" wow..... cool.... farm in Thailand is not easy to find even if you have the address, they are relatively deep in and most smaller road and lane have no names at all

The first pics is Mr Pat, Me and Mr Lek

The next day and not knowing what to expect, I meet up with Pat and hope into him car and off we go to his farm.

I was skeptical at first prior to this trip to Thailand, we can always see nice pics posted on Website. Those really nice one do not really exist in reality because photo are usually taken to hide or enhance certain features of the fishes. And sad to say, as everyone also know, Good Jap fishes are keep for their domestic market, like wise for Thai fishes, the really good only seldom or nvr hit our shores.

Now back to my trip to Mr Pat's Farm. The first thing that welcome me is...."his DOG"..wahahhaha... a really friendly dog... pound on me and started licking..wahhahah.. I love dogs

After some hand shaking and introduction, I was introduce to Mr Kitikorn (Lek) and other partners & management stuff..... The welcome was warm and Mr Pat speaks Beautiful English and Mr Lek can speak english relatively well too so commuincation was not an issue.

When they starts to bring me around..... my jaws drop. It was the biggest congregations of Champion Ranchu I have ever seen. and their fishes are simply incredible........... Not in my life have I seen so many champion grade nisai and Oya swimming together and their size are huge (20cm & above) I heard in thailand, if one hopes to win, the fish have to be above 18cm.

.......... to cut the story short.... I will added comments as I goes,....

when it was time for me to choose fishes... I was in a lost..wahahhahah.... I do not know how to choose..... because most of the fish are excellent fish and and we talking abt hundreds of them.... I don;t not know how to start..... (The Farm have not open to public yet & I am their 2nd customer , that explain the huge quantity of good grade fishes)
Finally I talk to Mr Lek:" Mr Lek, can u help me choose some tosai that u think can enter competition in singapore" wahahahah..... you see, Mr Lek is the master breeder, he know where his best fishes are. Mr Lek stand thinking for a while and heard towards his prize tub and pick up 2 tosai for me to choose and another one more junior tosai of a slightly different bloodline.... those were beautiful fishes.... I pick one of the pcs that are championship grade and the other smaller showgrade Tosai......

I will type more comments are the pics are posted

From what Pat and Lek have told me, they don't feed any color enhance food to the fishes, eg.... spirulina..etc...

But some of their fishes are very very red.

More Pics

More Pics

Hi,

Correct me if I'm wrong, if I see the picture of Mr. Boy's and Mr. Pat's ranchu, looks like Mr. Boy's ranchu is a long bodied ranchu and Mr. Pat's ranchu is a short bodied ranchu ? is this right ?

What is the difference between them both in terms of growth ? will it affect the head growth ?

Just my observation

Thanks

hi...

The long body ranchu is from Mr Dew (2 fo 4 series). Mr Pat fish is not short body, it;s just the body is not the very long body type like My Lew. I still have a lot of photo to post.... hang on....

Wallauu...yah I meant Mr. Dew not Mr. Boy ... I think I need to have my lunch now..

I will post all the pics first then add comment

I will post all the pics first then add comment

Put the fish in a tank to take side view pics

The Ozone Machine and the Arapaima

Hi,

must had been a fruitful trip , how many ranchu did you brought home? How much did you spend on them?

Chan

Yap... it was a extemely fruitful trip

..... let's put it this way, I am getting much better quality fish at very reasonable price as compare to Singapore LFS price.

cheers

Hi,

The ozone machine looks very interesting, do you mind telling us Pat, how do you use this baby

This ozone machine is a patent that belongs to a scientist friend of mind, it is called Corona type. It is a new way of forming ozone. It comes equip with built in air pump and can be used right in any container. The one in the picture is the smallest model, which we use to clean live feeds. Live feed will be treated with ozone directly from the machine for 15 minutes twice. The ozone kills off every organisms, virus, parasites and nitrates, and other nasty stuffs, even some of the live feed. But freshly killed live feed is quite alright to feed. The fish rather enjoyed them, since they do not have to chase the food. I have hired scientist to come test the water, each of our live feeds and found that I need to find a way to sterilize things without using chemicals and ozone is what I invested in. We have a bigger unit that we use for the big tanks and cleaning the ponds, as well. It's the only way that we can be sure of clean habitat. It should not be used with live fish present, unless it is supervised by qualified operator only.

Sawasdee krap.

Hi Pat,

Thanks for the explanation.

Does this means that after going through the ozone process, the live feeds are 100% safe ?

Sorry if it is out of the way, but do you mind telling me how much such a unit cost in Thailand ?

Thanks
Nanik

Haven't had a lot of problem with sick fish from live feeds for quite some time now. This does not mean that we do not have sick fish. The thing is fish will have all the bad germs on them already. That's a fact. It is when the fish is weak that's when these germs start to cause problem. As long as you keep the water condition good, and clean your feed, and keep up the general health of the habitat, your fish should be quite alright what ever kind of food you want to feed.

After a long exposure(over 10 minutes) in a test of the effect of the ozone, every thing dies. Even the germs that cause the smell of the feed is dead. The smell is gone too.

erm....ah......eh.....Edmund...
wat competition are you trying to participate with all your showgrade topview??

errr.... East Ozeki competition end of this year or early next year...wahahhahahah....if they allow me to participate at the first place...wahhahahhaha....

Comp details...hehhehehe... nothing conform lah

what talking u? simi east ozeki competition?
what does ozeki stands for?

East Ozeki Competition??

bro, the competition is a private one lah....

btw, its strictly Jap fish only....
there's something which the Thai haven't achieve after so many years of breeding topview ranchu...something lacking....hehehehe hintzzz**

Don't you have to be a member of some sort of Kai in Japan to enter into a competition ?

East Ozeki Competition

= to select the east ozeki from many east ozekis?? hehehe
(like the European Champions League?? )


OZEKI

pronounced as OR CHEE KEE
(maybe a subsidiary of OLD CHANG KEE currypuff??)

izzit....hehheheheheh I told u I don't know liao mah...whahahhahahahha

Are u sure it is stickly for Japanese fish only, there are no predessor of thai fish competiting ??

wahahhaha

the East Ozeki comp is meant to be a joke lah.... but indeed I heard there is a comp coming up soon which are open to all top view, irregardless whether Thai or jap.

Maybe u guys can check with Alvin, he might know something.

cheers

even a top quality Thai showgrade will make a fool out of itself when compared to a Jap side by side....

so?? what do u think??

wow........ do I smell gun powder....

can u care to elaborate on that ? please enlighten us.

cheers

My fish lost to only 3 fish from Japan in the Oya Class of the Thailand Championship judge by Mr.Fugami, Mr. Tajiro, and Mr. Ogata of the Japanese Ranchu Association. All three fish cost over one hundred thousand baht. I say I did okay. The top fish was one of Mr.Kashino private fish bought for almost two hundred thousand baht. Even the judges at the Show were keen to mentioned that the top five Oyas in the show were the same grade as the one entered in the AJRS. (Mr.Fugami,Sr.'s word to the organizer of the show.) I say that Thailand is only second to Japan, only.

In comparison overall, there are a lot more nice fish in Japan as they have been doing it for over a thousand years. But we have been producing better and better fish. Japan has already started to import our fish as well. They used to buy a lot of black ranchus only, but now, our topviews are in great demand. Japan do not make enough nice fish to satisfy their domestic demand. You want a nice Japanese fish, good luck. They are more expensive than a nice Arowana. A nice Thai fish will cost you halfl as much for the same quality.

Your view is similar to most enthusiasts in Thailand. The more expensive the fish, the better. This is a tactic of most fish dealer. If you know how to breed fish, then you can forego this circle of doom.

I would like to see all the nice Japanese fish you have in Singapore, you can post the pictures and I will show you Thai fish that can compete.

gunpowder??
nothing of that sort....hehehehe
i keep Thai fish myself and i am damn proud of it.....

further details we can discuss and share among ourselves on LIVE! tomolo night....
i am in no position to enlighten anybody....i am just a party organizer....

I apologize, then.

You kind of struck a nerve with me.

Pat....
how do you think you will fare if you happen to participate in AJRS??
and did you find out what is the reason that made you lost to their fish??

I know a good Jap fish will cost a bomb, well i could proudly say i can't afford...
its way way beyond my financial means....
and a Thai fish costing much less than a Jap fish of same quality ??
in wat terms do u mean by same or similar quality??
how do you judge a topview ranchu??
if it is the same quality as the Jap, in a business minded point of view, why dun you bring up the selling price of the fish if it is comparable with the Jap fish??
people will still buy....just like a MADE IN Thailand Honda Accord selling in Singapore....agree it cost a little less but not a big diff....

i know that you are a seasoned participant and a renown person in Thailand dealing with topview ranchu, your presence in RG certainly gain my respect.
so can you kindly enlighten on Thai Topview Ranchu judging criteria??
and did you advice/teach our beloved Caster on what to look for in a showgrade ranchu since he is very keen and sincere in entering a competition??

i am not up to any standard or position to accept any challenge from you....
i am just a normal hobbyist.....still enjoying the hobby....

and btw, if a still picture can tell the quaility of a TOPVIEW ranchu, i would gladly bow out of this topic.....i have nothing to say then....

cheers....


*p.s. bloodworms in SG dun come in can form....
they are sold frozen in plastic/foil packing

i apologize too if i happen to offend anyone here...

pat, if u are in SG, i really hope to meet up with you and have a good chat....

oh...btw, i will be in BKK from 22/4 to 25/4 with my family....
not going to buy any fish.....will try to meet up with you for a coffee if it is not of any inconvenience to you....

cheers! burp!! ooops.. 1

First of all let me say that I am very sensitive with this subject, since I have the same argument with my close friends in the ranchu circle here. I have to apologize again. Just a gut reaction on the keyboard.(BAD PAT, BAD PAT )

How do I know that we have progress. It is because we all use the same standards, the Nichiran Standards. Nichiran is the Japanese Ranchu Association in Japanese. (I learned that from Mr.Geert today.) The judges that we used in our major competitions are all Japanese judges. We do not change their standards in any way to fit our tradition. We utilize it 100%. How do we know this? We have many leading breeders (and I mean many) who have come to Thailand to give lectures on standards, caretaking, breeding and competition. They will also be judges in competition every time they come. Ranchu competition is meant for breeders to take their fish to get criticised by their fellow ranchu peers. It is a measure stick to guage the progress of your ranchu endeavour.ranchu standards have been set for a long time by tradition in secrets and now the standards rest in the capable arms of the Japan Ranchu Association.

The detail of the standards can be downloaded at Geert's website at the Belgium Honzokai Site.

The fish that I mentioned that I competed against are Champions from Japan, imported at Tosai size fish.(That's why their prices are in the hundred thousand range. They are proven winners with pedigree and trophy.

The cost associate with doing fish in Thailand and in Japan are totally different. To do what I do in Thailand in Japan will cost in the millions of US dollars.Simple economics here. It will be rediculous that I charge the same price as them even though I buy my seeds from them. My best is not cheap, but it is no where near the price of nice Japanese fish.

I want to send my fish to compete in the AJRS but the there are so many steps and we need to have a partner in Japan who is a part of a kai which will allow us to join their local competition first. That's going to be real difficult.


To be the best you have to eminate the best. Just like Japan did after WWII.

I am the one that have to apologize, I got personal over fish. That's crazy chief. I am sorry. Getting too serious with this fish thing, gotta back off a bit. Time for a diet coke.

I would love to meet with you. Brother Caster has my number, or else send me a mail and I'll send you my number. You can come have coffee at the farm and we can talk fish. I promise, no pitch. Just looking at fish and talking ranchu standards. Looking at a lot of fish will increase your ability to notice good fish.

i understand how you feel.....

"ahhhhhh.....so close.....ahhhhhhh....."

eh guys relax ah, come to tamp i blanjah u all "Dom's super ranchu expresso"!!!

Drink aldy sure SUPER SONG & STEAM!!!

Brudder, you should visit his farm and look at how his fish swims if that is what u are talking about.... as for th myth about Thai fish cannot swim like a Jap fish..wahahhaha.... I am a novice although have seen the JAp Ranchu VCD on swimming action a couple of times, I was not able to see a significant different in Pat's top fishes.....as I say, I am a novice, and do not the eye of a trained master.

hehheeh..... I literally requested Pat to scope out a couple of top fish to see it's swimming action in the big enamel basin.. and try to compare with those I saw in the VCD..hehheheh... still not convince, I request Pat to put the fish back into the pond so that I can see it's swimming action again..wahahahh... thank you Pat for your patients.

Brudder u go to Pat's farm and go see how his fish swim lah. after u see... that u came back and let us know what u think.

I am saying this because my crappy Thai fish certainly does not swim like my Japs. But my New thai certain swim nicer than my crappy Jap...wahahahhahahah....

curious, where & when did you bought your jap fish from?

don't tell you...wahahhahahahha... are u surprise that some Jap fish don't swim very well ? Or do you believe that the crappiest Jap fish still swim better than a good thai ranchu ?

cheers

don't talk nonsense
if the fish's features r crap, there is a limit that to what it can do, its like comparing a crippled, and an athletic

but ne.. if the athletic never groom properly, a crippled fitted with artificial legs may outrun the athletic

Everybody!

Please give caster a big hand for his effort to put up all the pics here and in the other three threads for us to drool over!

:cheers1

wahahhahhaha.... agree........

I am a novice, please guide me along

Thank you HB, it's my pleasure.

I do travel to Jap a few times a year. If the doors are open, I would love to do similar field photo report on Japan Ranchu farm and Ranchu Culture.

cheers

bring a videocam along if u do drop by Japan

Do you know of any place I can see a true blue good quality Jap swimmer that I can look at in Singapore ?

The way Thai fish swim is still fresh in my mind, I would love to look at how a good Jap swim. Those that I saw in some LFS specialising in Jap Ranchu does not impress me.

thanks and cheers

Ozeki Tanglin Mall Competition on the 1st of Jan each year would be what I know..

other than that... those at LFS r normally way too stressed to swim properly

oic..... Tanglin Mall competition... I have been there to look at those Jap fish.....hmmmm...... I have taken quite a few photo then and even video tape some..... but have since deleted them liao.

So I guess I will still have to fall back on VCD after all....wahhahahhahaha..... and the myth continues for me.....